Published: September 10, 2004
Part three of Boxingtalks exclusive conversation with Mike Tyson, Shelly Finkel and Ted Watley is a four-way conference call between these three men and Greg Leon. Boxingtalk subscribers get to be a fly on the wall as the former heavyweight champion of the world has it out with his manager and advisor.
Watley has a contract with Finkel that entitles him to half of whatever Finkels earnings generated by Tyson. Once Watley was conferenced, here is how conversation went:
Tyson said, “How are you doing Ted? I’ve got Shelly Finkel on with me and I’ve got Greg, the brother you told to call me today. What’s happening here? From what I heard everybody is going back and forth making a fool out of me. Tell him what’s in your paper Greg.” Watley cut in before I said a word, “I could tell you what I said Michael. What I’m saying is that Shelly has been lying to you from day one and in the fight in Louisville [in which an injured Tyson was knocked out by Danny Williams], Kentucky he ripped you off again.”
Mike Tyson: “No, no, no. Don’t show nothing. Just tell me brother, I want to know. You can tell me before you show it because I want to know.”
Ted Watley: “And if he doesn’t sue me I’m suing him.”
Shelly Finkel: “That’s fine Ted, you’ll be sued this week.”
Mike Tyson: “Just give me my information though. I want you guys to tell me the same shit you’ve been telling Greg.”
Ted Watley: “What I’m telling the reporter is that Shelly Finkel has been deceiving you from day one. I’m also telling the reporter that for the Louisville fight you’ve been deceived again. The only difference between you being deceived then and now is that I have the right to test Shelly’s actions, take him into a courtroom and prove my point.”
Shelly Finkel: “Well I’m going to be there Ted, so we’ll see what happens.”
Ted Watley: “Shelly claims that he’s going to sue me which I hope he does.”
Shelly Finkel: “I am.”
Mike Tyson: Why is my shit being avoided here? Nobody wants to answer me. What did Shelly do to me since I’m a dumb mother*****er who doesn’t know what was going on??
Ted Watley: “He deceived you, he totally deceived you, that’s what he did.”
Mike Tyson: “How did he deceive me? What did he do?”
Ted Watley: “With all this crap he’s telling you about you owe Showtime. You don’t owe those mother*****ers nothing!”
Mike Tyson: “You know I agree with you on that 100%. I agree with you on that one.”
Ted Watley: “And now they’ve got a guy who they can’t pay off and they can’t trick. See the trick that Shelly Finkel uses Michael, he does things he shouldn’t because nobody will really challenge him like me. Another thing, he thinks he’s slick enough to fool a courtroom. If he feels he’s so clever, but he has met a guy who is 61 years-old and I told you going in Michael, from the very first day we started, I’m not going to let nobody ***** you, including Shelly Finkel.”
Mike Tyson: “Really?”
Ted Watley: “And I’m telling you that this guy here has done nothing but deceive you from day one. And I trusted him here.”
Shelly Finkel: “And you have nothing but lied on this phone Ted. You’ve been nothing but a liar on this phone.”
Ted Watley: “I trusted in him Michael and in trusting in him, I’ve found out that this man is one of the biggest liars I’ve ever done business with in my life. I hope to God he sues me…?
Shelly Finkel: “I’m going to so your wishes will be met.”
Mike Tyson: “But do you guys understand that this has humiliated me? Hello?”
Ted Watley: (continuing to talk over Mike) “Once we get into a federal court he will have to produce everything that I ask for. And I’m going to take you into that courtroom and show you that without any doubt what I am talking about. And if he thinks he’s slick enough to con the courts, that’s cool because I can’t wait to get there. That’s what we’re talking.”
Shelly Finkel: “Everything he’s said is a lie.”
Ted Watley: “We’ll see about that Shelly, I don’t hear your bullshit, you talk to Michael. I’m gone!” (Watley hangs up on his call)
Shelly Finkel: “Everything he told you Mike is a lie and it will be proven.”
Mike Tyson: “I’m sure.”
Shelly Finkel: “He is a total con-artist.”
Mike Tyson: “I guess these guys all think I’m some mundane lethargic beast that they could rip-off since Don King did a good job. I guess it’s pervasive that I’m just a sap.”
Shelly Finkel: “But you know better with me.”
Mike Tyson: “After talking with Greg, I don’t know shit!”
Greg Leon: “And Shelly, I just want to make it clear that all I’ve done is tell Mike what’s been going on, what’s happened and some of the things that have been said along the way.”
Shelly Finkel: “I didn’t think you would lie about it.”
Greg Leon: “Well all I told Mike was what happened and the order that it happened, because he was in the dark.”
Mike Tyson: “In the dark big-time Greg, thank you!”
Shelly Finkel: “Greg, all I wanted to say is you got a phone call where the guy accused me of this, that and this. I put on every person, Jonathan Blue and all of the people he accused. They got on the phone with you and told you different. You ran your two pieces, then yesterday he came on again and I gave you the contract for you to see.”
Greg Leon: “The first piece is where you told me you were bringing him as a father figure hoping he can relate better to Mike on certain issues.”
Mike Tyson: “Why because he’s a nigger? So he can talk to me and he can relate because we have the same skin color? As long I’ve known you Shelly, you think because he’s a *****ing nigger he can talk to me? Because he’s a nigger he can talk to me? Do you think it came to that now??
Shelly Finkel: “Not at all!”
Mike Tyson: “You can’t understand him so you need a nigger to understand him. You don’t understand me Shelly you’ve known me since I was fourteen years old!”
Shelly Finkel: “Mike, what was the first time I brought you with him? With all of the footage he said he had for you. I asked Jackie about it today and she said he’s a con-artist.”
Mike Tyson: “After all I’ve been through in my life publicly, do you think I give a ***** about you trying to save me and over some reputation with somebody else?”
Shelly Finkel: “No!”
Mike Tyson: “I don’t care about what anyone thinks about me but you’re supposed to protect me, but you let somebody come into our little world. Why did you even let him into our world??
Shelly Finkel: “Because I made a mistake.?
Mike Tyson: “So I have to pay for your mistake.”
Shelly Finkel: “I’m paying…”
Mike Tyson: “But my name is the main topic of this mother*****er.”
Shelly Finkel: “He accused me. He didn’t say you.”
Mike Tyson: “He accused you of what? He accused you of *****ing over Mike Tyson.”
Shelly Finkel: “And it’s bullshit and the thing is…?
Mike Tyson: “No, no, no. It’s not bullshit when people like Greg and Michael Katz get a hold of it. It makes me look like the proverbial dumb sap mother*****er.”
Shelly Finkel: “And then when I beat his ass in court, it will show that it wasn’t. I’m suing him. I’ve already retained counsel and that’s being done. When that is done you will look how it is, that you went with the right people and you never were screwed.”
Mike Tyson: “I’m going to be real with you Greg, the only reason I’m doing this shit is because they talked me into a good mother*****er, paying my bills and taking care of my shit. If it wasn’t for me trying to be a decent person and be an honest man and pay my bills which these people amounted on me and caused me to own, because it’s not my fault that I owe this kind of bill. But if I wasn’t trying to be a decent man for my children I would say ***** these mother*****ers and this bill and what they say I owe them. All they do is use me, they try to manipulate me. If you don’t do this we’re going to ***** up your kids life and trust fund and I was basically intimidated to fight against all of these people because of what they were going to do, the repercussions would have affected my children.”
Shelly Finkel: “And that’s the truth Greg, he’s doing this for his kids.”
Mike Tyson: “You don’t even have to say shit Shelly, I don’t need nobody to co-sign that. I’m doing this for my kids, but whatever I’m doing is for their best interest. Everybody benefits from this but me, I don’t get no money from these bullshit fights and I don’t want to do this shit no more Greg. I go through this shit, pay a bill and then it’s on to something else, whatever it is. But all these guys don’t give a ***** about me and it’s *****ed up out here and it just is what it is. Me and Cus worked so hard to become the best fighter that God produced and this is what happened, I fall into the hands of s*****bag mother*****ers who feed me to the wolves and just look at me as a meal ticket or a mattress to sleep on. It’s a sad sight, but it is what it is. Nobody is doing this because they care about my well-being, they want that dollar. And I can’t blame them, but it just is what it is. It’s a *****ing tragic story, I’m never going to have no money no more. By the way my situation is so *****ed up I will never again be a rich man financially. It’s an ugly story but I’m making the most of it.?
“These mother*****ers say they care about me like a father and son, but they see how I’m living, I’m *****ed up and they can’t help me get a nice place to live. I’m *****ed out here Greg living like a bum. They can’t even put money together to get me a nice place to live and get on my feet. That’s the kind of team I got. Did you know that Greg?”
Greg Leon: “No I didn’t know that.”
Mike Tyson: Well that’s the kind of team I got, they love me so much and they care about so much that I’m *****ed up out here doing horrendous. They love me so much they won’t even chip in together to help me get a job where I can make some money on the side. Nothing.”
Shelly Finkel: “That’s what I did today.”
Mike Tyson: “Naw, y’all just want to keep me fighting. Y’all don’t want me to get a job, you just want me to fight, fight, fight. If it wasn’t for my children and I wasn’t a Muslim… I’m trying to be a decent Muslim and being a Muslim a helluva thing Greg because it’s a very complex religion. My life has changed over the last three months and I want to be a decent person now because I know every decision I make is a big one so I always keep things in perspective and I’m conscious of my actions but we all know what the story is, the boxer and his great managers and promoters, they love him like a son because he’s different than other niggers, he’s special. You know how that situation turns out. At one time I thought I was better than those guys and it would never happen to me, I guess I’m no better than Joe Louis or Muhammad Ali. I’m just keeping it real Greg and it is what is.”
Greg Leon: “Are you there Shelly?”
Shelly Finkel: “Yes.”
Mike Tyson: “You know what it is Greg, if a mother*****er cared about me I wouldn’t be in the situation that I’m in. I’m known all over the world and people know who I am. These champs can’t go all over the world and have people know who they are, but the fact is, I’m the big fool they could have their money I don’t have mine. I might be this big time superstar but I’m truly a pauper. These guys are fighting and I have don’t have nothing and they’re fighting for something.”
Shelly Finkel: “I wasn’t fighting, I was defending myself on it. I didn’t start it.”
Mike Tyson: “I hear you brother, but this is not about you, this is about me telling Greg how I feel. I know what you’re doing Shelly because we’re all defending ourselves, I’m just tired of defending myself on my own shit. I used to have over 100 people around, now I’m surprised that I got my son and his mother around me, but they’re starting to get tired of my shit now so I’m going to have to find a new place and get the ***** out of here because you know how they get tired of your shit sometimes? They’re tired of my shit because I’m not living the way a Muslim should be living, and that means that I’m going to have to find somebody else to shack up with like a mother*****ing vagrant! They’re fighting over me and I damn near homeless. I got to go from one person’s house to another, I’ll probably have to kiss somebody’s ass but I have to do what I need to do until I get back on my feet. I will never be super rich like I was before, but I’m going to be on my grind.”
Greg Leon: Is there anything else you’d like to say Shelly?
Shelly Finkel: “I don’t believe that’s the end of it and I don’t believe that’s how Mike will end up. I’ve had some talks about a house for you out in Phoenix today, but I want to see you first.”
Mike Tyson: “Everybody has been trying to do things for months and years and I’m still in my situation. I’ve heard that story before.?
Shelly Finkel: By the way Mike, I introduced you to Greg in Jersey….?
Mike Tyson: “I don’t know Greg’s ass like that but he called me and told me some good shit today and I’m vibing with him. But I’m just explaining myself to Greg, you don’t have nothing to say Shelly, I’m talking to Greg about me. This is about me Greg and my pain. You want the story nigga, this is what it is. Mike is out here grinding man. I’m here living with somebody and they’re tired of my shit, so I’m going to have to bounce soon but I don’t see these mother*****ers trying to get me out of here for nothing. I’m probably going to have to go…who am I going to have to bullshit to stay over their house now? Am I going to have to stay with somebody I don’t like anymore? I’m too old for that bullshit and I need my own situation.”
Greg Leon: “You just made $2M, how are you shacking up from one place to the other??
Mike Tyson: “Because I’ve got to build my bank account back up baby. I’ve got to build my shit back up so I’m going to have to eat shit now. I got kids over here and shit, he needs a bank account. Everybody else got money, all my other kids got a bunch of millions why not him? Is he going to be the only cousin to beg for money and they’re going to be looking at him like he’s some weird mother*****er? That’s just the way it is, and that money should go to him too, but I’ve got to start my scratch again because that’s their shit. I’ve made money and blew my money and let these dirty, stinking mother*****ers take my money already. I don’t got no money, this their money.?
“My leg *****ed me up and I did a lot of thinking because this is my last hurrah really and it’s just a helluva thing. I don’t want to do this no more Greg, I don’t got that instinct no more. I don’t know what happened to me that night but the preparation didn’t come out and I just don’t got that shit no more, you know Greg??
Greg Leon: “You don’t feel it anymore.”
Mike Tyson: “Naw, I don’t feel like that mother*****er who wants to kill everybody kittens, go into the house and leave the house a bloody mess. I’m not that person no more. I like hanging out with my children and my birds now. I got to be that person sometimes and I portray that person to help me get a dollar because I can’t make no money being a decent guy. I can’t be presentable to these people because they’ll think I’m out of my *****ing mind. I have to be a beast, I have to curse at these people, talk about their mothers and *****ing them up their ass, but I’m not the guy I portray myself to be when I’m doing my thing.”
GL:” Do you feel that if you decided to never fight again that one of the major networks would step up to the plate with a commentating gig for you?”
Mike Tyson: “Oh hell no, they think I’m a dumb stag. They don’t think I’m qualified for that shit, they respect my skills as a fighter they don’t respect me as a man or as a human being, just as a fighter. I’m like an animal to them, a savage. But if I need to feed my kids being a savage, they’re going to have Jack The Ripper on their hands.?
GL: Do you feel that would be a gig would be able to excel at if given the opportunity?
Shelly Finkel: “Excuse me Mike, when you did your videos, you commentated the best on that with the most knowledge.”
Mike Tyson: “That’s true but look at my record, I’m the rapist and the violent man.”
Shelly Finkel: “But the guys who wouldn’t talk you before called me today on you.”
Mike Tyson: “Say what?”
Shelly Finkel: “Electronic Arts who in the past wouldn’t do a video game with you are now calling me for you.”
Mike Tyson: “You know what Shelly? You shouldn’t handle that because you’re a boxing man, you should hand that to somebody who handles that business.”
Shelly Finkel: “I’ve done that for twenty years when I was in the music business.”
Mike Tyson: “Please trust me Shelly, if you’re going to work with me you need to work with me on my fights. Have those guys call me and I’ll have them talk to my lawyer. You can’t help me with everything, it can’t be like that brother. If you want to help me with my fights, help me with that when we get everything settled, but other than that stay out of everything else. Please, nobody is going to help me and nobody gives a ***** about me unless I got those gloves on. I’m out here trying to feed these kids and nobody is trying to help me feed these kids. These mother*****ers don’t got no money over here, do you think we have money over here Shelly??
Shelly Finkel: “No.”
Mike Tyson: “We’ve got no money over here, but he just got $2M, but I don’t have shit. I don’t feel any less of a man than anyone on this planet”
Greg Leon: “Over the past few days the current status of how you’re living didn’t really come up.”
Mike Tyson: “But it did come out and that’s the effective part. What you’re talking about with Shelly and Ted is bullshit, that’s nigger ass greedy shit. These guys are playing, I don’t know what kind of game they’re playing, but Shelly brought the guy in. So whatever happened, that’s Shelly’s fault.”
Shelly Finkel: “Agreed and I accept that.”
Mike Tyson: “And I don’t know if we’ve opened a Pandora’s box, I don’t know shit just don’t look right. Both of these guys are living well in their homes and they’re fighting over me, who is basically homeless with nowhere to go. I don’t have a residence with my mother*****ing signature on it. They’re beasting over me. Why aren’t they beasting over how they’re going to help Mike? Help me get on my feet? Why don’t they fight about that instead of fighting over some *****ing money. Since they care about me like father’s and all that bullshit, why don’t they help me when I’m *****ed up with a low self esteem because of my situation, but I got to stay strong because I got a little boy who has to look up to me. I need to keep up that front because what I really want to do might be inconceivable.”
GL: “What do you really want to do?”
Mike Tyson: “I really just want to say the hell with this shit but I got responsibility out here. It’s a bad enough they think I’m a serial rapist, I at least have to pay my bills, I don’t want them to think I’m dishonest, it’s bad enough they think I’m a *****ing criminal. I’m not no reporter kind of guy, but I’m so happy you called me man. My girl was calling me from New York and told me there was some ugly shit on the internet with what Ted and them were saying about each other and about you. I’ve got all my business in disarray and you have two sixty year old men talking like *****es. Y’all are supposed to be guys I’m working in business and we supposed to work together but y’all can’t keep your shit together. You bring this guy, and I don’t know why you bring him in, maybe you thought this nigger was going to control me. I don’t even know what the situation was but I’m not even going to get there and it’s just sick. Sometimes I’m probably glad it happened this way it did because it was all done for the wrong *****ing reasons.”
GL: Shelly already proved to me that he and Ted Watley aren’t legally partners and he says he’s going to prove everything else wrong in court.
Mike Tyson: “I’ll believe that when it happens. It’s an ugly thing man that these people are going through this shit and they think that I’m the only one in the center of this shit. I’m always the *****ing target but why can’t I go to bed without anybody that loves me reading about some crazy ass shit in the paper.”
Shelly Finkel: “But what do you do when a guy attacks you like he did? I didn’t want that. I didn’t want it to bother me, him, you or anyone.”
Mike Tyson: “But it did because you brought him in my circle, that’s what happened.”
Shelly Finkel: “Right, and the thing is I brought the guy in because he was going to be a good guy for all of us, I thought he had all the stuff on tape and I am wrong. He started all this shit and now I’m going to correct it. I would have gone on with my mistake when it was over, but now I realize different. I was warned about it, people told me. Now the guy attacked and I will defend it, that’s all I will do and I will not try to keep you in the middle of it.”
Mike Tyson: “Thank you Shelly. But Greg like I said, I’m not in this game. I’m here physically, but if I was in this *****ing game all these *****ing guys would be *****ing dead, and their mother’s would be running into the ring crying because I knocked them unconscious.”
Greg Leon: “This is a conversation that Mike wanted on the record Shelly, how do you feel about that?”
Shelly Finkel: “Whatever he wants is fine.”
Credit goes to boxingtalk.com